tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1430463007570237159.post67538352922350407..comments2024-03-27T18:42:55.138+00:00Comments on KEITH'S WARGAMING BLOG: Playing With Toy SoldiersKeith Flinthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12903769462646267048noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1430463007570237159.post-43798359159634062852014-08-26T22:57:20.430+01:002014-08-26T22:57:20.430+01:00I think a huge part of the issue in the 80s was th...I think a huge part of the issue in the 80s was the idea that to get an accurate 'simulation' you had to cram in as much technical detail as possible. So game play got lost and very often the 'simulation' got also lost in the forest of irrelevant factoids.<br /><br />Richard Clark of Too Fat Lardies has some very good ideas on being able to simulate something while still having a good game. You just have to pick what you want to simulate and then abstract the rest.Jameshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14996350912869829140noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1430463007570237159.post-63271683574822591062014-08-26T21:40:50.118+01:002014-08-26T21:40:50.118+01:00I still view my hobby as 'playing with toy sol...I still view my hobby as 'playing with toy soldiers'. I want a fun game that gives me a feel of the period etc, alongside which I will learn some history. What I don't want is a very realstic simulation. I remember a post on the Blitzkreig Commander forum by Major Dave Fielder (rtd) who had 'suffered' such simulations as part of his training. When he wanted a wargame, he wanted one that was fun, noy one that was a simulation.Steve J.https://www.blogger.com/profile/12143308117853983963noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1430463007570237159.post-61714267216747397982014-08-26T11:27:56.590+01:002014-08-26T11:27:56.590+01:00Spot on Keith. I was an impressionable young fello...Spot on Keith. I was an impressionable young fellow in the 70's when I first encountered Jeffreys and Grants Napoleonic books and WRG 3rd ancients with their emphasis on constant scale. <br /><br />It didn't really sunk in at the time that the latter two talked about it and then threw it away once they got to the table for an actual game. Took me even longer to appreciate that my earlier books that focused on the look and feel crossed with how they encouraged players produced better games more fun and just as accurate. <br /><br />I still struggle with these things some days when the constant scale ghost catches me or find myself being overly sensitive to silly suggestions that a game that is not an "accurate siumulation" is no different that tiddlywinks.Ross Mac rmacfa@gmail.comhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04053555991679802013noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1430463007570237159.post-69976089625369915082014-08-26T10:16:21.022+01:002014-08-26T10:16:21.022+01:00BTW, a slightly related issue about "what min...BTW, a slightly related issue about "what miniature wargaming is all about" sometimes crops up when digital tools are discussed. Some think that once we have large digital iPad-like tables, we can move figures around, and all stats etc. are managed by the software. But this also misses the point. Miniature wargaming is an analogue hobby about pushing toy soldiers around, rolling dice yourself etc. That is the core idea.<br /><br />It's almost as if telling someone who practices bow shooting that using a pistol is much more efficient in hitting the target. Yes, of course it is, but that's not the point. The point is to use the bow and shoot an arrow, not hitting the target al all costs.Phil Dutréhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13607941040736764291noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1430463007570237159.post-66302338485993950282014-08-26T10:12:10.312+01:002014-08-26T10:12:10.312+01:00Another symptom of these shifting ideas about warg...Another symptom of these shifting ideas about wargaming can also be seen when one reads the old wargaming books by Featherstone et al. The early books still emphasize the toy soldier as a figure - and one can see chapters in early books on how to paint figures and what the different uniforms looked like. I guess this was because wargaming back then still had strong links with the military modeling hobby, and "historical realism" was all about making your soldiers look visually plausible, rather than making the gameplay historically plausible. In other words, early wargaming was about visual realism, not tactical realism.<br /><br />I suppose that this emphasis on the individual figure also drove the wargaming rules that were designed bottom-up: starting from individual figures and working your way up towards entire units, rather than start from the unit as a basic playing piece and merely using the toy soldiers as a convenient playing piece.<br /><br />Of course, from the moment one starts to think about tactics on the battlefield as the main design goal, then the figures are relegated to some sort of afterthought. So yes, I can see the reasoning of Paddy Griffith, but I agree with you that he therefore missed the point w.r.t. *hobby* wargaming. It's all about visual appeal!Phil Dutréhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13607941040736764291noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1430463007570237159.post-53792633395607870172014-08-25T21:56:47.334+01:002014-08-25T21:56:47.334+01:00Keith,
I suppose that I count as a "grown ma...Keith,<br /><br />I suppose that I count as a "grown man", but I suspect that I am still really a child in an old man's body.<br /><br />In any event I still much prefer mucking about with toy soldiers to pretending that they represent "reality". I'm just having fun (and learning a bit of history on the side as well).<br /><br />I agree with your stance (but I'm still a little boy at heart).<br /><br /><br />-- Jeff<br />Bluebear Jeffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05171345165563779232noreply@blogger.com